[Karig]

Hello, all. This is my first post.

I've been thinking somewhat about why the OT was so appealing to me, and why the PT has lots of attractive and imaginative eye candy but still left me cold and didn't feel special like the OT did. I don't think it is just because I've gotten older (I was 12 when ANH came out in the summer of 1977).

I think it's the characters. I think it's because I can identify with Luke and Han, and to some extent Leia. I don't get that same vicarious "rapport", so to speak, with Qui-Gon, Obi-Wan, Anakin, Shmi, Padme/Amidala, Yoda, Mace, Jar-Jar, or any of the other characters in the PT. The characters in the PT that aren't just flat-out undignified strike me as basically lacking warmth and seem like they'd be less than friendly in person; the characters in the OT don't strike me that way. The OT characters had a little charisma; the PT characters don't -- not for me, anyway.

I think that if the characters were stronger, warmer, more likable, less annoying, I'd be a lot more inclined to overlook a lot of the flaws that this whole website is devoted to documenting. I might be more inclined to overlook the many continuity errors between the OT and the PT, as described on other threads here. I might be more inclined to forgive the little jokes that GL throws into the PT, with Jar-Jar Binks trodding in bantha droppings, E.T.s in the Senate on Coruscant, etc. I might be more inclined to forgive GL's making his galaxy so small that everybody seems to have at least a nodding acquaintance with everybody else -- Yoda apparently knows Chewbacca in ROTS, Anakin just happens to build (in TPM) the very same C-3PO that reappears on the very same Death Star where Anakin as Vader can be found (in ANH), etc., etc. I might even be inclined to forgive GL for his embarrassing attempts at humor in both TPM and AOTC. I'd forgive a lot. The OT had its share of bad acting and bad dialogue, but I don't really care.

I think the galaxy of the OT, while not as pretty to look at as that in the PT, is a friendlier place, if you take my meaning.

The point of this very long post is to ask two questions:

(1) If you also liked the OT but disliked the PT, do you think this observation might explain why for you too? Does this idea crystallize the problem for anybody else, or do a lot of people think the problem with the PT (if you agree there is one) lies elsewhere?

(2) Is there anybody here who liked the characters in the PT? I don't mean merely that you don't mind spending two hours per picture watching them speechify and run around; I mean, do you like any of these characters?

[Mnesymone]

One of the things I have already said is that you don't feel for the characters in the PT - the conclusion lightsaber battle in TPM was boring, partly because none of the characters were properly established.
Of TPM, the character with the least right to be there, Qui-Gon, was the only one that warmed at all, in AOTC no one warmed at all, and only in ROTS did I see Obi-Wan and Anakin at all... the people we saw in TPM and AOTC were not Obi-Wan and Anakin... one was a guy with a good english voice who said lines from the original trilogy with all the gusto of a goldfish suffocating and the other was a whining bitch.

[Lord Melkor]

If I were 4 or 5 years younger I could identify with Anakin in AOTC. I also felt being held beck when I was 15.

But yes, AOTC especially lacks any interesting character development and conflict.

[GreviousMAKESmeSAD]

The characters in the OT talk like regular people. In the PT, I don't know what's going on, but it seems like it all should be 200 years earlier, than 20.

Also someone said something about anakin and c3p0 earlier that makes me think of a rather humorous alternate ending to A New Hope.

Vader: I sense something. Something I haven't felt since...
[I]Vader wanders off.
INT. HANGAR CONTROL ROOM
C3P0 - Oh listen to them. They're dying R2. It's all my fault.
A knock. C3P0 nervously eyes the door. All of sudden it is ripped apart. In storms Vader.
Vader - We meet again C3P0.
C3P0 - Oh dear. Have we met before?
Vader - Search your feelings C3P0. Obi Wan has erased your memory, but he never told you who your father was.
C3P0 - I was actually under the impression that I was built on an assembly line on Yavin 4. I have been known to be wrong from time to time though.
Vader - I am your father C3P0!
C3P0 - Oh dear.

This post has been edited by GreviousMAKESmeSAD: 06 June 2005 - 11:54 AM

[andy_k_250]

Hello, all. This is my first post.

I've been thinking somewhat about why the OT was so appealing to me, and why the PT has lots of attractive and imaginative eye candy but still left me cold and didn't feel special like the OT did. I don't think it is just because I've gotten older (I was 12 when ANH came out in the summer of 1977).

I think it's the characters. I think it's because I can identify with Luke and Han, and to some extent Leia. I don't get that same vicarious "rapport", so to speak, with Qui-Gon, Obi-Wan, Anakin, Shmi, Padme/Amidala, Yoda, Mace, Jar-Jar, or any of the other characters in the PT. The characters in the PT that aren't just flat-out undignified strike me as basically lacking warmth and seem like they'd be less than friendly in person; the characters in the OT don't strike me that way. The OT characters had a little charisma; the PT characters don't -- not for me, anyway.

I think that if the characters were stronger, warmer, more likable, less annoying, I'd be a lot more inclined to overlook a lot of the flaws that this whole website is devoted to documenting. I might be more inclined to overlook the many continuity errors between the OT and the PT, as described on other threads here. I might be more inclined to forgive the little jokes that GL throws into the PT, with Jar-Jar Binks trodding in bantha droppings, E.T.s in the Senate on Coruscant, etc. I might be more inclined to forgive GL's making his galaxy so small that everybody seems to have at least a nodding acquaintance with everybody else -- Yoda apparently knows Chewbacca in ROTS, Anakin just happens to build (in TPM) the very same C-3PO that reappears on the very same Death Star where Anakin as Vader can be found (in ANH), etc., etc. I might even be inclined to forgive GL for his embarrassing attempts at humor in both TPM and AOTC. I'd forgive a lot. The OT had its share of bad acting and bad dialogue, but I don't really care.

I think the galaxy of the OT, while not as pretty to look at as that in the PT, is a friendlier place, if you take my meaning.

The point of this very long post is to ask two questions:

(1) If you also liked the OT but disliked the PT, do you think this observation might explain why for you too? Does this idea crystallize the problem for anybody else, or do a lot of people think the problem with the PT (if you agree there is one) lies elsewhere?

(2) Is there anybody here who liked the characters in the PT? I don't mean merely that you don't mind spending two hours per picture watching them speechify and run around; I mean, do you like any of these characters?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I agree with everything you said, except the OT galaxy is prettier. It is more realistic anyway.

[Michel Orla]

Um, nobody? Palpatine was slimey, Bail Organa was likable but not a major character, Padme had absolutely no character and both Sith apprentances did nothing for me. Dooku couldn't make up his mind wether he wanted to be good or evvvvviiiiiillllll.

Every alien, including Jar Jar and the Gungans, Watto, that stupid two headed Pod Race announcer, the Nimrodians, Selbulba (the list goes on and on) annoyed me more than anything. Other than Artoo, I hated all the droids too. I thought Theerpio got on my nerves in ESB and ROTJ...He was enjoyable compared to his "witty one-liners" in the PT

Most Jedi are uptight assholes- Yoda came across as an unfeeling, smartass know it all, Mace was just boring, Anakin wasn't much likable save a few scenes in ROTS...Obi Wan was useless in TPM and had a few good scenes in AOTC. However I really enjoyed him in ROTS, until he just walked away from Anakin. So I guess my choice is Obi Wan

This post has been edited by Michel Orla: 06 June 2005 - 02:05 PM

[ernesttomlinson]

My favourite character from the prequels is a midichlorian in Obi-Wan's blood named Philippides.

[barend]

Vader:  I sense something.  Something I haven't felt since...
Vader wanders off.
INT.  HANGAR CONTROL ROOM
C3P0 - Oh listen to them. They're dying R2.  It's all my fault.
A knock.  C3P0 nervously eyes the door.  All of sudden it is ripped apart.  In storms Vader.
Vader - We meet again C3P0.
C3P0 - Oh dear.  Have we met before?
Vader - Search your feelings C3P0.  Obi Wan has erased your memory, but he never told you who your father was.
C3P0 - I was actually under the impression that I was built on an assembly line on Yavin 4.  I have been known to be wrong from time to time though.
Vader -  I am your father C3P0!
C3P0 - Oh dear.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

additionally, Vader could storm into Mos Eisley Cantina interupting the exchange between greedo and solo and "shoot first"

VADER: *flips a coin to han* "sorry for the mess... childhhod thing..."

This post has been edited by barend: 07 June 2005 - 02:16 AM

[CowboyCurtis]

Well, I can't say "identify with" but the character that I come the closest to actually liking is Obi-Wan, and that has to do with Ewan McGregor who can actually act. He did what he could do.

[SithAvenger]

You know, I have an idiot friend who likes the Gungans. (Don't you think it's unique?)
Maybe clumsy people actually feel identified by JAR JAR!

Oh, what a world, what a world!

[barend]

the end of ROTS should have been really emotional...

if only they had made anikan a likeable character...

[Primetime]

I think you're all forgetting about all the robots and cyborgs out there who have a lot of heroes they can relate to in these movies (because there are heroes on both sides, remember?)

[Hari Seldon]

My favourite character from the prequels is a midichlorian in Obi-Wan's blood named Philippides.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yep.
Also thought he was the *best*.

[LiocModnar]

Alright I'll bite. *zips up asbestos suit*

My mentor reminds me of Qui Gon both in bending rules and never seeming to get angry despite the many opportunities I've given him. As for me, I'm ashamed to admit a certain sympathy for Anakin since I know how it feels to be held back on account of age. Fortunately I'm not anybody's prophecy project and I'd have tried to kill Palpatine after he admitted he didn't know how to prevent death. If there weren't continuity constraints, it would have been far more devious to return to the temple to play the slayer of the Sith lord and mourn the unfortunate death of the person who told you to stay home in the first place.... noooooooooo!

[Revan-47]

Revenge of the Sith actually caused me to like anakin as a character. the whole time i was wanting him to stay good.who would have thought a prequel could do that