Jesus Death - Suicide? Did Jesus commit suicide and if so ... is he in hell?
#2
Posted 17 December 2009 - 03:40 AM
Always wondered why people let that slide so easily. I mean, he based his fame on him being the son and knowing exactly what was going on and what dad had in mind for the world, and then he just lets his tongue slip and practically admits to not having a damn clue about his intentions.
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#3
Posted 17 December 2009 - 05:52 PM
The Hebrew of the passage in question - Eli Eli Lama sabachthani- literally means: God, God, depart from? or God, God, abandon? (as a question).
So really it could even mean something different from what everyone's been taught, which is usually based on the King James Version - which if you know anything about biblical translations, you know is actually quite mistranslated.
http://en.wikipedia....you_forsaken_me
Dude was in massive pain. He could have said something even sillier and I think the Christian masses would have let it slide.
#4
Posted 18 December 2009 - 12:01 AM
Yoda
#5
Posted 18 December 2009 - 03:55 AM
I suppose what makes Jesus death comparable to suicide is that he not only knew he was going to die and did nothing to thwart his death but in fact helped the course of events along by telling Judas (at the Last Supper) to basically hurry along with the betrayal. If he really felt he was doing others a service through his death then perhaps it could be classed as suicide with a noble purpose ... but suicide all the same.
Also ... isn't it interesting that in Mark (generally considered the earliest gospel) Jesus seems far more human and far less divine with regard to the cruxifiction - he seems to be acting a hell of a lot more like someone wondering whether this was all going to go to plan (that God would intervene and save him) than a divine being who was certain of coming events.
If he is in hell however I assume that makes it a whole lot less horror inflicting, like adding cold water to hot to make nice lukewarm water/infinite punishment
#6
Posted 18 December 2009 - 06:09 PM
Jesus knew he was to be killed for the things he was saying, and he refused to renege on them when given the chance. That is martyrdom, not suicide. Like if you were captured by enemies to your faith/people/army, and under duress you were given an opportunity to sell your people/country/beliefs out in exchange for your life. Refusal to do so is not suicide.
#7
Posted 20 December 2009 - 07:20 PM
civilian_number_two, on 18 December 2009 - 06:09 PM, said:
Jesus knew he was to be killed for the things he was saying, and he refused to renege on them when given the chance. That is martyrdom, not suicide. Like if you were captured by enemies to your faith/people/army, and under duress you were given an opportunity to sell your people/country/beliefs out in exchange for your life. Refusal to do so is not suicide.
#8
Posted 20 December 2009 - 07:23 PM
That said, I would love to see a new biblical epic directed by G Lucas where Jesus and the Disciples are played by little people.
Three words: BOX OFFICE GOLD
#9
Posted 21 December 2009 - 02:20 PM
Jesus didn't kill himself; he sacrificed himself as Civ explained. Although Jesus didn't resist his death, to say that he was suicidal and therefore in Hell seems like splitting hairs.
Is it accepted that suicidals necessarily go to Hell? I thought that was Catholic tradition. (As in, within the Catholic dogma, not that it's Catholic tradition to commit suicide.)
This post has been edited by Ninja Duck: 21 December 2009 - 02:21 PM
#12
Posted 04 February 2010 - 12:03 AM
Next question: Did Jesus create religion? If No Jesus means no peace, do wolves know peace?
Bonus question: Was Jesus a wolf? What about a furry?
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#13
Posted 26 March 2010 - 09:54 AM
-Jimmy McTavern, 1938.
#14
Posted 07 April 2010 - 07:35 AM
Deucaon, on 26 March 2010 - 04:54 PM, said:
Now now, let's not make up facts to suit our argument.
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#15
Posted 07 April 2010 - 08:40 AM
Gobbler, on 07 April 2010 - 10:35 PM, said:
What argument? I'm just stating a fact.
-Jimmy McTavern, 1938.