[Helena]

Obviously most of us here would rather pretend the Prequels didn't exist, but with Star Wars 'canon' coming from so many different sources (movies, books, games...), most people have several sources they regard as authoritative and others which they prefer to ignore. I thought it would be interesting to compare our different views on what counts as canon (as opposed to the 'official' version defined by George Lucas).

So what do you guys include in your own 'personal canon'? Personally I prefer to ignore everything apart from the OT and the first KotOR game (not the sequel), though obviously I acknowledge that all those other things are technically canon according to Lucas. Sadly.

[Despondent]

Star Wars and The Empire Strikes Back.

Jedi ruined a lot of what made those two films so great. I haven't played kotor so I won't include that, although I understand it's terrific. But after the fans started building importance into everything implied (Boba's pausing while firing at Luke on Bespin et al), there's no way GL could authoritatively wrangle back control. But he doesn't get a pass either: There's no excuse for him insulting our intelligence by lying about his failed efforts, albeit the first time or the thousandth.

[Chefelf]

I'd like to add the first Thrawn trilogy by Zahn. Also, the Courtship of Princess Leia (mostly because it's HILARIOUS).

KOTOR is a good addition, though it takes place 4000 years before the OT so there's not a really huge effect.

[Madam Corvax]

Courtship of Princess Leia is "hilarious"? True, it does have some pretty unbelievable dialogue ("I like the way your pants fit" is quite an unlikely utterance by Princess Leia to Han Solo) and some very goofy ideas like this empire ruled by women, and the story of ancestry of Han Solo... *sigh* well, I'd say, upon consideration you are right, it is hilarious, which is a pity because it is the only SW book that I own.

I'd like to know the reasons why you consider it hilarious, though...

Coming back to the topic, though, the "canon" idea came from Star Trek, didn't it, where Roddenberry himself acknowledged that books are not "cannon" even those he wrote himself, which was reasonable given the number of writers which were involved in Star Trek series. It is nearly impossible to keep up the consistency within the universe without single all-knowing co-ordinator. So they tried to keep the TV series and films consistent with each other story-telling wise and regard the books as sort of fan-fiction.

And since Lucas's films themselves are pretty inconsistent with themselves, I cannot make up rigid boundary what is canon what is not. I like everything which is in "spiritual consistence " with my idea of Star Wars universe, however vague that might sound. ROTJ got some things right - like Luke throwing away his lighsabre and refusing to fight (the moment which actually saves the whole film for me), on the other hand little furry creatures are totally out of places The prequels have only the LOOK of the SW universe right - just visuals. And KOTOR is the perfect example of what SW universe should be.

[Helena]

MC, I know what you mean about 'spiritual consistency'. The first KotOR captured that perfectly for me; the prequel movies, and what I've seen of the rest of the EU, did not.

[Chefelf]

I haven't read the book since it was released. I just remember thinking it was a hilarious concept. Also, Threepio had a lot of good one-liners as I remember. He was really not written in his typical way but it was quite amusing.

[jariten]

Star Wars 1-6, and Shadows of the Empire.

Maybe this Jar Jar colouring book my nephew got years ago, since it had this story about how Jar Jar got the part for Qui Gon that made Anakins pod work. This proves that without Jar Jar, there would be no Star Wars! One in the eye for the naysayers methinks.

[Despondent]

SW 1-6 is contradictory, but if you prefer your canon to operate like a rubik's cube, who am I to argue with your understanding?

I'll keep SW and ESB, and add the SWHS.

[barend]

SW, ESB, about 80% of ROTJ.

KOTOR 1 because it felt like Star Wars (I trust my feelings)

Maybe KOTOR 2 when they finish making it.

and what the hell I'll throw in that no smoking add with R2 and C3P0.

[civilian_number_two]

STAR WARS, EMPIRE, a lot of JEDI (but none of the Leia-is-the-other-hope-and-also-Luke's-sister stuff), the Midichlorians and the Virgin Birth, The mundane idea that "angels" are like mermaids in space, some of the Marvel comics series, and the animated part of the Holiday Special.

This post has been edited by civilian_number_two: 17 January 2008 - 12:20 AM

[Supes]

I tend to agree with a lot of people here. My canon is as follows:

Star Wars
Empire
Most of Jedi
Thrawn Trilogy
KOTOR

These collectively fill all the parts I need to know to make it all come together.

[barend]

The Thrawn trilogy works for me two but I never finished it...

[Despondent]

Thrillogy?

[Saberist]

Obviously most of us here would rather pretend the Prequels didn't exist, but with Star Wars 'canon' coming from so many different sources (movies, books, games...), most people have several sources they regard as authoritative and others which they prefer to ignore. I thought it would be interesting to compare our different views on what counts as canon (as opposed to the 'official' version defined by George Lucas).

So what do you guys include in your own 'personal canon'? Personally I prefer to ignore everything apart from the OT and the first KotOR game (not the sequel), though obviously I acknowledge that all those other things are technically canon according to Lucas. Sadly.

A New Hope, yes. Ironically, it's so childish in execution it's almost completely open ended for improvement on some good basic concepts.

Empire to the moment when the space slug arrives and then a little dip to the moment when "I am your father..." and Luke doesn't wave his stump and laugh "Yeah, now pull my other finger!" Past which nothing is worth saving because that's one of those 'surprise!' moments that really can't be moved past or developed from the scenario as already built (there really was _zero_ excuse for Kenobi and Yoda to deny this knowledge since clearly Luke CAN handle the information so long as it's not thrown at him all at once.).

I'm sorry but there is absolutely nothing worth saving from ROTJ. I despise Han Solo so he doesn't do it for me and Luke 'rescuing buddy and daddy' rather than the universe feels like another huge copout to what was proven (selfishly) wrong in Empire. Three more films so that Vader can become someone with his own goals rather than some pandering 'love you, I give you away to evil' cretin and Leia can become a Jedi would have been vastly preferrable.

KOTOR is a good basic story but I didn't like the Rakatan as the precursor species which predates the Republic. I would prefer that we got our Force donais from some wiser alien culture rather than one so completely corrupted (fighting a 12ft tall Rakata 'tomb guardian' type character on the Star Forge or at the Pyramid might have been cool though...).

Finally, being as this was about a period of WAR in the universe, the juvie sidequests simply make no sense, especially because Bastilla was all that was holding the Republic together against the massive capabilities of the Star Forge manufacturing process.

I won't go into gameplay beyond saying that a computer RPG could still be a lot cleaner and more fluid with nothing more than a pause-change action set of keys and a mouseclick ability to set geometries of attack and defense. While I despise ranged weapons that don't hit nothin' AT RANGE!


Saberist


Would it be okay to mention _Splinter Of The Mind's Eye_ as a good basic story and IMO, preferrable starting point for introducing Luke to the deeper mysteries of the Force? I like the Luke/Leia angle. The way she smiles at him unabashedly vs. can't stand to look at Ford in ANH is beautiful vs. snarky. And the fact that they are both dedicated to the point where they don't have much time for other stuff yet still need a common grounding in humanity to offset their 'noble cause' was so much cooler than pretty girl gone submissive for the tall dark and dangerous moron.

[TruJade]

I have trouble with the alot of the expanded universe
but if they ever were to make an Episode 7, 8, 9
it would be a good place to start

i don't remember which book it is but i really hate Lukes proposal to Mara Jade
they basically think they are gonna die so hey, lets get married
and when they survive neither one of them has the courage to say no, not really

epecially since Mara was sent to kill Luke in the first place
and the whole she has a diease and can't have children, no wait we found a cure
and they have the whiny annoying Ben

I don't mind the PT as far as story without visual
because the story of how a crush turns into a misguided infatuation
drawn out for years is probable but the way it all goes down was dumb

id actually just prefer to live in
the clone wars era for the next 5 years
the rest is just too much

This post has been edited by TruJade: 20 January 2008 - 11:57 PM