[xenduck]

i dont know if this is the place to say what i want to say. I would like, as im sure many others would, to try and improve the dispositions of most people here towards the prequal movies. hopeless? maybe, maybe not.
what bothers me is that you all seem like intelligent people who are real fans of star wars but apperantly just dont understand what is going on in the new films. maybe im the one confused, and maybe you can change my mind, maybe not. the point is that im very interested in discussing, point for point, every reason listed for hating both prequal movies.
the funny thing is, i ran across this sight as i was pondering writing an essay about all the reasons to love epI and II. i hope that the chefelf himself can spare a few moments to converse with another star wars fan about our diffrent views.

id like to hear from anyone and everyone at xenduck@yahoo.com

[Hannibal]

...Star Wars sucks dude, there's nothing you can do about it.

[Chefelf]

i hope that the chefelf himself can spare a few moments to converse with another star wars fan about our diffrent views.

id like to hear from anyone and everyone at xenduck@yahoo.com

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I would love to converse with you on the subject. However, rather than emailing a bunch of different people just post your thoughts and questions here and you will get a lot of response. For the most part we do our best to answer questions intelligently. I'd be happy to share my views on the prequels and what I feel are the major disappointments/flaws, etc.

So, feel free to start a topic and we'd love to jump in. Just a warning: make sure you're not too thin-skinned. Prequel lovers don't venture here very often but there are a few that are regulars here. I respect them a lot because they are certainly in the minority and are very open-minded about a lot of the criticism that goes on here, particularly the more closed-minded criticism.

[use the force]

ive tried many times dude, many times.

[jariten]

xenduck- if you're still around, start a topic. I'd love to read your reasons why you like the prequels if you've got the time to post them. Just remember that apart from me and a couple of others everyone is anti prequel. I'd like to get someone else on my side though so post something!

[CowboyCurtis]

I think the jumping off point, Xenduck would be that the OT came first----and I'm not talking about the SE's... the unmolested versions.

All that you needed to know, and all that the prequels should've been based on the few words spoken by Obi-Wan himself. Watch them. Listen to his words CAREFULLY.

Sure, the prequels with numbers on them SAY they're first, but it's the OT that should shape what happens in the PT, not the other way around.

[nerfherder69]

Just a thought about something wrong with the original Star Wars....

My friend pointed out that when Han Solo is leaving at the end of the film while Luke is getting ready to take on the Death Star, he is loading up large crates that are his "reward."

Was he paid in pennies? I know it was a big reward, but how small is the Star Wars currency that would require him to load many crates onto his ship? Don't they have debit cards? A cashiers check? I just think crates and crates of money is an inefficient way to handle currency.

[srmoore]

They pay in lead... so it takes a lot of it.

Seriously.. I have a feeling it was like some sort of raw material.. not like paper money. I mean.. they are a rebel force.. not like they have a tresury building somewhere stamping out coins and what not.

[use the force]

maybe we shouldnt look into things like this because its starting to ruin the movies.

[Despondent]

yeah, we'd hate to hasten the beginning of these movies going bad.

[xenduck]

ok, xenduck here, sorry ive been sorta off the map for awhile. i am thrilled by everyone's enthusiasim and it gives me conviction to tackle such an imposing list. honestly, ive never posted messages before so i apologise if im not doin' it 'right'. for some reason id like to tackle ep II first, if that's ok.

so reason #1
i am sorry you dont like the title, (attack of the clones). it is a little magoo. but i am glad George gave a nod to his roots. so many filmakers think they are so original and forget, or refuse to admit, that its all been done before. i dont like the title much either, but George isnt selling out.

reason #2
padme says she shouldnt have come back, i took that to mean she had been gone a few days to hide from assasins. honestly, had zam been chasing her all over? i thought zam hung out on coruscant waiting for padme to get back. the point is, no one says how long she'd been gone, nor how long she'd been a senator for that matter. so we could both be right, remind me to ask George next time i see him.

reason #3
padme brushes off yoda, well, she's a stone-faced politician who was very nearly killed a few miniuets ago. id be a little gruff too.

reason #4
the spice miners: star wars has alway been about the 'used future' feel. so the audience shouldnt expect to know all about everything that is going on in the galaxy. and is there some connection between the miners on naboo and the miners of sub terral? maybe, kamino clones?

reason #5
you dont like jimmy smitts? come on, thats your opinion and you're welcome to it. but is that really a good reason to bad mouth any movie? i dont think so, who agrees?

reason #6
if i understand correctly, you were agitated when they mentioned spice miners and then never brought them up again. well, hear George makes a point to bring up another one-liner for continuity's sake and you are agitated at that as well. maybe i misunderstand but it seems that is on the darkside of nitpicking.

i got more but i dont wanna over do it my first time out. let me know if you would like to hear more. dont worry im thick skinned and confident in my views. i want to hear from all of you out there! on a side note, these are the reasons i disagree, i.e. why I dont dislike the movies. there are a whole lot more reasons why i love all five films.

This post has been edited by xenduck: 16 March 2005 - 12:59 AM

[jariten]

Its good to see that you didn't jump ship! What I really recommend that you do is start a thread of your own and just get some of your ideas out there. How about it?

edit- I like Chefelf's lists a lot. Despite the fact that I only agree with about 10 of them, they are far more entertaining than most of the critisicm the prequels got (ok, so "George Lucas raped my childhood!" was funnier, but that humour was unintentional). But theres a LOT of them, and to go through them all one by one will take you forever. Thats why I suggested starting your own thread, one we can all jump in on.

This post has been edited by jariten: 16 March 2005 - 04:12 AM

[Slynt aka Ree Yees]

Today I discovered this site and the reasons to hate... page.

I must say there is at least 100 more things to bash about TPM and AOTC ( I had lists of 100 nitpicks on each at theforce.net a while ago).

ROTJ deserves some more. Especially the fact that in ROTJ, all of a sudden, Luke Skywalker's saber doesn't cut off or penetrate anything on Jabba's sail barge.
Another moment of it doesn't make any sense.

[DragonLord]

Hi everybody! Just registered to the site and thought I'd chip in with my thoughts. Although I agree on almost every one of the reasons that Chefelf has written, I feel that he has missed out on many annoying things. I don't remember them all right now but I'll just mention one that I can think of right off the top of my head.

In AOTC, when Anakin and Padme are having dinner, Padme says something like "are you going to read my mind", to which Anakin responds "that only works on the weak minded". Excuse me? Vader reads Lukes mind in ROTJ about having a sister, the Emperor reads Vaders mind when he says "and now I sense you wish to continue your search for young Skywalker" or something like that. Are Luke and Vader weakminded?
Lifeforms that are skilled in the jedi-arts can mindcontrol only weak lifeforms, but they can read the minds of stronger foes. The line is totally wrong.

Another (minor) annoying reason that just appeared in my head is in TPM when Watto has made a bet with Qui-Gon and uses a "chancecube" to settle it. While I don't find it so annoying that the chance-cube has 6 sides, I do find it annoying that Watto even though Watto knows that he is dealing with a Jedi (on account of Qui-Gons try of the jedi mindtrick) he nevertheless still lets the bet be settled by a chance cube. He is a Jedi, he can move objects with with the help of the force. Jeez..

/ DragonLord

[DragonLord]

Oh another annoying thing just hit me, and I don't think I've read anything about it among Chefelfs reasons. He does mention it but not the way I have problems with it.

When you see Episode 4-6, you get the feeling that Anakin was a very powerful Jedi who later became even more powerful when turning to the dark side. Since he killed all but two Jedi knights, he is more powerful than an ordinary Jedi-knight(as we understand when they refer to him as the 'chosen one' etc) Now the emperor is just purely evil, and the scene where he uses his 'lightning' to try to kill Luke shows how powerful he is (I will call this ability for "lightning force" in the future). Yoda is of course a Jedi-master, and in Episode 4-6 we don't see him fight at all. But we still sense that he is more powerful that Obi-wan and Anakin since he is a jedi-MASTER. So the 'ranking' goes:

The Emperor and Yoda > Anakin > Obi-wan

Since the emperor is purely evil, he is the only one who truly masters the power of the dark side. (Remember when he says "your feeble skills are no match for the power of the dark side". No Jedi-knight should stand a chance against this foe.)

This brings me to my problem: Who the hell is Count Doku? Why is he so powerful that he can use 'lightning'-force? Now we can't understand who is stronger than who. If Anakin is to become very powerful, then surely he must also be able to use 'lightning'-force when he turns to the dark side? Is that what distinguishes turning to the dark side? Shooting lightning? If so why didn't Darth Maul do this? This means that Anakin is not so special that we first were made to believe.

Another problem: How the hell did Obi-Wan block this powerful 'lightning'force with his lightsaber? Is it that easy? Just hold your lightsaber up and block the evil force that only a powerful Sith Lord can master? This means that if Luke hadn't been stupid enough to throw his lightsaber away in ROTJ he would have blocked the emperors 'lightning'-force and slayed the emperor himself. This doesn't seem right. If a powerful Sith Lord (without a lightsaber) meets a 10year old kid who has a lightsaber, the Sith Lord has to use the force to drop a rock on him or push him away, but he can't shoot lightning on him because the lightsaber just blocks it. Very very very stupid scene in my opinion. Count Doku shouldn't have lightning abilities, and Obi-wan shouldn't be able to block with his lightsaber.

Which leads me to the Count Dokus: "It is obvious that this contest cannot be decided by our knowledge of the Force, but by our skills with a lightsaber."

Chefelf commented on this, but in my opinion it needs further comment. The Jedi can sense things before they happen. This is how they can block blasters with their lightsabers. They don't learn this at fencingschool, the just sense where they are going to get hit, with the power of the force. It is the same thing in a lightsaber duel. They sense eachothers attacks, which makes lightsaber duels between Jedi-knights and Sith Lords interesting. With a stupid comment like this, it seems like a Jedi-knights skills with a lightsaber has absolutely nothing to do with his knowledge of the force. Very stupid line.

This all means that a powerful Sith Lord who can use lightning skills would be no match for a weak Jedi-knight with some knowledge of the force but with 10 years of lightsaber training at some sort of fencingschool.

The explanation of midichlorians together with Count Dokus remarks of this kind, and his ability to use 'lightning'force (which can be blocked by a lightsaber...) just destroys 'The Force'. It is just annoying and stupid what these new movies have done. In Episode 3-6 the force was something mystical and now it is all about midicholorians? Is George Lucas going to explain with the help of midichlorians how you can see your dead friends through the force in Episode 3?

To those of you how like the prequels and don't understand how people like me can dislike these new movies I have one thing to say: Don't try to change our minds. The majority of us hate the prequels, and for good reason. Just read Chefelfs reasons. Midichlorians? Yoda jumping around like sonic the hedgehog? Samuel L Jackson saying: "This party's over"?? Please! This is not about taste anymore. It's about the truth. The truth is that these movies suck. We hate them. Sites such as ChefElf's didn't just come up because some people dislike these movies, they came up because many many many people truly truly truly hate Episode I and II, and most of us think George Lucas is an idiot. People who can't see that these movies suck are blind.

Keep up the good work ChefElf.

/ DragonLord